Forums - ST:balrog vs honda,who had more win chance? Show all 11 posts from this thread on one page Forums (http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/index.php) - Strategy & Tactics (http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?forumid=10) -- ST:balrog vs honda,who had more win chance? (http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=35865) Posted by balrog on 08:14:2001 10:52 AM: ST:balrog vs honda,who had more win chance? balrog does more damage Posted by balrog on 08:16:2001 09:14 AM: still got 0 answer! Posted by balrog on 08:18:2001 11:28 AM: i think rog will win cos he had the headbutt to counter honda torpedo! Posted by ashapiro on 08:18:2001 12:44 PM: I don't know much about ST match-ups, but I think this one's pretty close. Honda can ochio Balrog out of his rushes if he's not careful, or jab headbutt things and what not. There was a very interesting match at B5 with Jason "Apoc" Gonzales versus Bob Painter's E. Honda. These are two of the best ST players in the US, and I always think Honda vs. Rog is an entertaining fight. Apoc just did repeated standing jabs with Balrog and it looked like there was nothing Honda could do about it. It was beating everything! When we got back to Texas and tried it out on our ST board, though, it turned out Honda can just hundred hand slap the jabs. I don't know if Mr. Painter tried this or not. I don't recall the match too vividly. It was definitely a fun one, though. Watching a great Honda against a great Balrog is always entertaining. As a Honda player, I think this is one of the most fun match-ups around. Both of these guys deal obscene amounts of damage. Anyone else want to comment on this match-up? - Aaron Shapiro Posted by ashapiro on 08:18:2001 12:44 PM: I don't know much about ST match-ups, but I think this one's pretty close. Honda can ochio Balrog out of his rushes if he's not careful, or jab headbutt things and what not. There was a very interesting match at B5 with Jason "Apoc" Gonzales versus Bob Painter's E. Honda. These are two of the best ST players in the US, and I always think Honda vs. Rog is an entertaining fight. Apoc just did repeated standing jabs with Balrog and it looked like there was nothing Honda could do about it. It was beating everything! When we got back to Texas and tried it out on our ST board, though, it turned out Honda can just hundred hand slap the jabs. I don't know if Mr. Painter tried this or not. I don't recall the match too vividly. It was definitely a fun one, though. Watching a great Honda against a great Balrog is always entertaining. As a Honda player, I think this is one of the most fun match-ups around. Both of these guys deal obscene amounts of damage. Anyone else want to comment on this one? - Aaron Shapiro Posted by Nothingness on 08:18:2001 04:39 PM: Some times i feel that balrog has the advanage, then other times i feel that honda does. For example when ever i play seths rog with my honda its usually A win for seth but when i was at MWC i played Coles balrog and i beat him 2 straight only to have him switch characters and beat me the next 3 ahhhhh! Itis tough for rog but with his super hes just too damn tough. 1 blocked headbutt means dead honda. Honda hands are a nice weapon vs balrog. I prefer hadbutt vs the dashes as well as hands. One thing you have to do vs balrog is stay on the ground and turtle your little buts of. Also you have to try and kill him before that super getscharged. Its useless to jumpin with either, due to there headbutt/shoulderbutt. Posted by Apoc on 08:19:2001 12:04 AM: I think this is a 50/50 fight all depending on positioning. But as far as the st.jab goes it basically limits Honda's movements. Basically killing his offensive options. There are counters to this from Honda as was pointed out but nothing that I can say is unpredictable or not easily countered. Generally the Honda wants to do far st.RH. Here he has to close distance without the use of any special. So he loses his charge in doing this. So in order to use this counter he must forfeit some counter options. So though st. rh is a good counter for this, because of the jabs Honda can't really capitalize after the counter. And it's not even a free counter. For Honda to use this counter he must walk forward. After a split second of Honda walking(enough time to kill even a delayed charge) Rog is free to attack in any way outside of a buffalo headbutt. Honda has no reversals to guarantee defense or to maintain the pressure he wants bring to change the momentum. Rog can watch and KNOW that Honda wants to use the st. RH and with that foreknowledge, counter in advance or jump and hit an early attack over the RH as it comes forcing a block and pushing him back further into the corner limiting Honda's options further or any number of aggressive tactics since Honda has beating the jab on his mind. But let's say Honda gets that Rh in. Then what? He has no charge, walks too slow and therefore can't even maintain the pressure and momentum by getting on top of Rog. He simply counters and gains damage but gains no tactical advantage. While with the jab there Rog can almost liberally cause block damage on Honda with blocked rushes. It would be(imo) impossible for a Honda to reversal headbutt dashes while turtling because of fakes and one mess-up and he's eating worse than block damage. Rather than illustrate this further I think you guys can see how the jabs put honda at a severe disadvantage strategically. As far as the slaps are concerned, unless you are on some kind of head to head there's no way you're going to bust out slaps without being obvious or getting your first normals standing fierced when they whiff as you're trying to start them up. It's too risky imo. In order to do that safely you have to start from a bit back. At this range Rog can simply cr. strong when the hands move forward. This is MUCH more risky than st. rh. And of course once Rog has super you can't use this at all. Once you have Honda frustrated by all of this you can start to bust things out at will as the honda player is trying to outwit what you are already doing. Most of the time Honda players block or get hit by what looks like random moves once you employ this tactic but really it's because they are trying so hard to counter Rog's defense so Honda can get in and do real damage that they actually forget that Rog can bust out any one of 4 kinds of Rushes while hitting that jab. That's my explanation of what I was doing anyway. I'd like to hear the other side of this from the Honda perspective since I don't know Honda as deeply as I'm sure Bob, Bill, Wilson or any real honda player would. Apoc. Posted by Nothingness on 08:19:2001 03:31 AM: When i played your Rog at B5 i think our match went sorta like you had described. I had the early lead by using a relentless hands attack followed up by sumosmashes. Rogs jabs are countered by doing 2 hands ( intentionally taking the hit for position) then do a smash to knock rog down then i can attmept a set up for ohciho. But what happened in our match was that you got your super before i could finish you off. Once your Rog had the super i pretty much could only block. I literally flinched for a second and you pulled out the super! DEAD honda! The jabs dont really fase me ill just keep em (hands) going and cancel into another special like smash or headbut. you can get in, but its tough. "IF" im lucky enough to ohicho you out of a careless dash i can get you, but a good rog dont just go dash crazy. So waiting for that move is a waste and very dangerous. I feel that this match is in rogs favor. Hondas only chance is a swift kill or for rog to miss his super ( not likely). =/ i give it to balrog 6-4 or 5.5-4.5 ... Bill g. Posted by balrog on 08:20:2001 02:50 AM: i also think balrog own honda:the no.1 reason is the buffolo headbutt own all honda's moves likes.torpedo,butt dirve and even the HHS!another reson is balrog does more damage!he will trade more damage.... rog super is much more deadly than honda,[when balrog blocked honda super,he can super combo honda which honda can't block!!!OMG],when rog had his sc charged,it means honda 's dead! Posted by balrog on 08:20:2001 10:57 AM: and wht about the winning chance for matches likes rog vs ryu,rog vs guile,etc???:> Posted by balrog on 08:21:2001 10:27 AM: pls tell me All times are GMT. The time now is 10:28 PM. 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